ZeldaBlog

Passing the Collection Plate

April 6th, 2007 at 12:02 am by The Missing Link

I have a theory, and I want to test it out.

How many of you have ever honest to gosh achieved a 100% run of Ocarina of Time? In case you’re not hip with the terminology, yo, I’m basically asking how many of you collected every weapon in the game, every possible item upgrade and stat booster, planted every Magic Bean, quested for every last Heart Piece, and—and here’s the kicker—hunted down all 100 Golden Skulltulas? Go ahead, raise your hands. There’s no one watching you; I know you’re at the computer in the privacy of your own home, so don’t feel silly. Raise your hand.

For those of you who have your hands raised (or are just really shy people and don’t have the Triforce of Courage at your beck and call—such shameful heroes you’d be!), now answer me this: How many of you did it without cheating? And to make sure we’re all on the same sheet of papyrus, yes, cheating includes using a strategy guide.

My theory is basically this. The number of you guys out there who still have your arms high up in the sky, proudly professing your Zelda pride, should number roughly on the order of one or two people. (I’d say zero, but I’m holding out on the chance that one of their kind actually bothers to read this blog every day and—if I so claimed zero—would proudly declare how wrong I would have been. People seem to love proving the TML wrong.) Regardless of the exact number, I can probably say with absolute certainty that the number of people who didn’t cheat would rank in the vast minority of Zelda players. With GameFAQs, official strategy guides, game discussion forums, and so forth growing by leaps and bounds, further entrenching its already near-stranglehold on the gaming community in general, I would argue that those players will nigh become extinct, probably about the time the Xbox 1080 and the PlayStation 6 come out.

Now before I get too far into this thing, let me admit that I have 100 percented a few games over time, some of them even without cheating! Super Mario Kart and Super Mario All-Stars were beaten every possible which way since Sunday (the latter of which was an absolute nightmare, I might add), and I spent a good amount of time collecting those secret shells in Minish Cap to get every figurine. (I even made an Excel spreadsheet to calculate for me what the optimal number of shells to spend in the slot machine was given the base probability of getting a new figurine. Yes, I am geek.) I’ve gotten all 120 stars from Super Mario 64 (albeit with online help), and my characters in Chrono Trigger are all at the maximum level. The final boss of Secret of Mana is by far no longer a challenge, any new save of my character in Gauntlet: Dark Legacy would be a step down, and my Samus is fully stocked for her upcoming battle with Metroid Prime.

But one thing I have not done is ever come close to a full completion of Ocarina of Time. I think my most complete save file (and this is only a guestimate, realise) stands somewhere around 14 hearts tops with only around 40 Skulltulas bagged. I never went around finding every last one of either of them, even to the point of completely skipping the Piece of Heart that is sitting in Zora’s River in plain sight because I couldn’t figure out how to get it within the first 30 seconds of trying. (I beat the game without desperately needing to scrap together every last heart piece I could find, so I didn’t exactly see the point!) Majora’s Mask is even worse, and while I may have all 24 masks, I think I only have 11 hearts. Eleven heart containers! That’s roughly missing some thirty-some heart pieces, more than half! (This is a complaint that I believe I registered before with you.)

Collection quests, at least to me, have lost their appeal for the most part. No longer do I voluntarily go questing on my own to do every last thing possible before hanging a game up; nay, I am perfectly content to let a game go beaten without throwing a celebration once I found the last object. Super Mario Sunshine (the game that I have singularly cursed at more times than any other game ever made… and I mean EVER) literally remains in its case with only the minimum number of shines needed to beat the game. I’ve given up trying to finish unlocking everything in F-Zero GX. I no longer have the need to get Pro status in all of the Wii Sports games. I decided last night that I would not go insane if I didn’t ever beat the Boss Endurance challenge in Kirby: Squeak Squad. And I have not dared to return to Twilight Princess to finish the last collection quest in it. (I don’t think I’m even going to care enough to actually do all the collection quests in my inevitable replay of the GameCube version of it.)

I think part of this is due to the fact that I have so much less time for gaming these days. When I get home from work at around 7:30 or 8:00 in the evening, I’m conflicted as to how to spend them. There are many things that I want to do; not only do I want to play video games, but I also want to roleplay, write fanfiction, catch up with my friends, write in my LiveJournal, write ZeldaBlog articles for you (;)), among many more things. This doesn’t even consider the fact that I have chores to do, need to shop for groceries and run errands, and attempt to have a social life. On top of this, the list of games in my queue is already growing. My games list currently includes Hotel Dusk: Room 215 (DS), Final Fantasy XII (PS2), God of War II (PS2), Viva Piñata (360), Super Paper Mario (Wii), Fire Emblem: Sacred Stones (GBA), Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance (GCN), Okami (PS2), Prince of Persia: The Sands of Time (GCN) and Skies of Arcadia Legends (GCN), not to mention the replays of Twilight Princess (GCN) and Tales of Symphonia (GCN) I keep promising myself I’m going to do. (And I haven’t even mentioned the Virtual Console games in that list!) With a list like that, the urge to 100% a game after I’ve beaten it has to be very strong or else I’m not going to go for it! (Look at what games I’m holding off on!)

So understand that, when I look at the sidequests of Twilight Princess, I’m bound to be rather disappointed. Many of the sidequests within Twilight are… you guessed it! Collection quests. (Note: This is not a spoiler; we knew about these back in October.) While there are sidequests that aren’t in this mold, none of them truly satiated by hunger for a genuine honest to gosh good sidequests like the ones at the end of Chrono Trigger or the Biggoron sword trading sequence in Ocarina of Time. The last thing I want to do is go questing for about a bajillion of one certain item in the world… much less without using a strategy guide to find them all. I don’t have the time nor patience enough to do it, and too many games are already begging me to finish them.

And my theory says that very few of you differ in opinion from me on this. And if that is the case, then these collection quests aren’t doing their intended purpose, which is to force us to explore every last possible corner until we find them.

So let’s put this to a Poll’s Voice, shall we? Let’s see how on the money I am today. What say you? (As always, the question and answers are slightly exaggerated. This is for humour, so please choose the answer that best suits your opinion, even if it may sound too extreme as written.)

How far would you go to find, say, all 192½ magical dohickeys in a Zelda title?
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Filed under Twilight Princess, Editorials, Ocarina of Time, Majora's Mask, Poll's Voice

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81 Messages from the Gossip Stones about “Passing the Collection Plate”

    Comments

    Ok, I used a strategy guide to help me get everything in OoT, but I do have a 100% game because of it. I haven’t had the time or motivation to bother with everything in the other games. I’m still working on the whole photography challenge in Wind Waker, but I never used a game guide for it.

    The only game that I’ve gotten close to 100% with is the Simpsons Hit and Run, and it’s 99% complete. I just need one last wasp camera… Still working on Mario 64, no online help with that one.

    I really don’t bother sidequesting for something outrageous like all of the poes or whatever. I think modern gamers really are just in it for the meat of the game - action and plot. They don’t mind grabbing a few things on the way, or even going out to grab a couple collectable items, but in the end they don’t care about someone saying there’s like, 40 of such and such item to collect. The reward for the TP quests was a disappointment for me. More than anything, I like games just for the ability to explore and scale-up my abilities. I like games that reward your snooping with secret passages and shortcuts or experience, or helpful items. LttP was a good example of this - they didn’t just give you some more money or something that was absolutely necessary; you could go out of your way to get a better shield, the ice rod, the good bee, the cape, the cane of byrna, and probably some other things I’ve forgotten. It wouldn’t have hurt for the developers of Twilight to come up with something gamers would have loved - fire and ice arrows, anyone? Or maybe the more traditional magic rods? How about remote bombs? Or a shield spell? Or a magic lantern - so you can finally forget about running out of oil? Or something more original to the Zelda series, like armor or a spell that deflects missile-attacks?

    Actually I plan to complete Twilight Princess to 100% without cheating. I have 18 of the hearts, all of the bugs, and 50 of the Poes so far. And I have everything else. So generally I only lack the last 2 hearts and the last 10 Poes. I didn’t do it with OoT. To be honest I just didn’t have the patience. But I plan to do it with TP. Yes, I have more time on my hands than you do TML.

    LoZ, ALttP and OoT remain the only three Zelda games I’ve 100%ed, and they will probably remain that way (though funnily enough, I felt the urge to try to finish my last collection quest in TP tonight, and soon put the thought out of my mind when I remembered how tiring it was running around the last time I tried), and though I’ve done them with the help of guides once or twice, I can confidently say that now I can do them from memory. Go me.

    But yes, for the most part, I find collection quests kinda pointless. Option number five is spot-on for me, and I’m glad others feel the way I do. If something to collect is in my line of sight, and I can see how to get it, I’ll probably spend the five seconds it’ll take to wander over to it. If I have to work for it, forget it. I just don’t care. In my mind, Link is supposed to be saving the world; he doesn’t really have time to stop and collect X, Y and Z items for trading sequences and sidequests (unless vitally integral to the game). Majora’s Mask, with its fifty-two Heart Pieces, was a nightmare come true for me, just for that (and while there were nearly as many in TP, at least there was that in-game “cheat”. You know what I mean). There’s enough collecting as it is: pendants/medallions, crystals/stones, and Triforce pieces, to name a few, have been featured over the years. Clearing the game is enough of a collection quest, especially if people keep screaming for more dungeons (that only means you’ll have more to collect, Grog! There is a flaw in your plan! *giggle*).

    Unfortunately, I’m not clear on a solution, either. Fewer collection quests, to be certain, but maybe there should be optional dungeons as well. That sounds like a regular ol’ sidequest at first, but an optional dungeon (or dungeons), with a boss and miniboss and everything, that affects events in the game, but is not vitally important, would be pretty cool (if this exists, please forgive me, as it’s very late and I’m nearing the limits of delirium right now). Imagine something like the Bottom of the Well, but longer, and a couple of items (none of which were necessary for the game, but would make it easier) hidden inside, and if you decide to beat these bosses (who are difficult), then the Final Boss becomes easier; if not, he retains full power. Two of those, I think, would keep my attention, especially if the goodies inside were GOOD goodies (and maybe even a collectible for Original Collection Quest, just to be sadistic (I like parenthetical asides, it seems)).

    Poo on collection quests!

    I can understand why most people would turn to Gamefaqs and Strategy Guides but I try to stay away from these, I have 100% completion on Final Fantasy VII, Ocarina of Time, Link to the Past and quite a few Pokemon games and thats with out turning to other sources for help. I personally dont like turning to others/other sources for help because when I play a game I want to do it myself.

    I’ve 100%ed every Zelda game except the Unmentionables, Four Swords, and Twilight Princess. I fully intend to get around to completing the latter, but I’ll have no qualms about turning to GameFAQs once things start feeling tedious. I agree that merely collecting stuff through general exploration is fairly pointless, but in the Zelda games, very often there is some extra puzzle or challenge one must face to obtain the optional items. It is for this challenge more than the item itself that I like to 100% each game at least once.

    The ultimate example would be the Hero’s Cave in OoA and OoS. These optional dungeons contained some truly hair-pulling puzzles which really forced me to grow as a Zelda player. Did I ever make use of the rings I received at the end? Not really. By the time I was finished with those dungeons, I was ready to school the final bosses while wearing the Cursed Ring. X) Bottom line, viva la sidequest, and if they’re part of a collection quest, I can live with that.

    Well, it wasn’t one of the options in the poll, but I would first find things on my own (in TP) and then when I ran out of places to hunt, I need a guide to help. I can’t trust the online ones, I found some of their information was wrong, so I need the book (which I don’t have) and the only game my sibling and I own is Kirby, Nightmare in Dreamland.

    VenusQueenOfFaeries said:

    Unfortunately, I’m not clear on a solution, either. Fewer collection quests, to be certain, but maybe there should be optional dungeons as well. That sounds like a regular ol’ sidequest at first, but an optional dungeon (or dungeons), with a boss and miniboss and everything, that affects events in the game, but is not vitally important, would be pretty cool (if this exists, please forgive me, as it’s very late and I’m nearing the limits of delirium right now). Imagine something like the Bottom of the Well, but longer, and a couple of items (none of which were necessary for the game, but would make it easier) hidden inside, and if you decide to beat these bosses (who are difficult), then the Final Boss becomes easier; if not, he retains full power. Two of those, I think, would keep my attention, especially if the goodies inside were GOOD goodies (and maybe even a collectible for Original Collection Quest, just to be sadistic (I like parenthetical asides, it seems)).

    I vote for optional bosses (and if Ninendo ever buys Square Enix, maybe we’ll finally fight Sephiroth, lol) the boss should be tougher than the final boss (like Ganon from OoT) and require a specific strategy, with exact timing placed in certain attacks, otherwise, Link is dead.

    Hm… well, I chose the second option. I tried to complete the main storyline of TP without using a guide of any sort, and- whilst I had to look up the solution to an incredibly frustrating puzzle (the solution of which I had overlooked due to a complete lack of observation) and a certain statue puzzle before of one of the dungeons- I managed to complete the game just fine without having to use a strategy guide, so that was alright… I admit that it felt more satisfying not using a game guide, and it didn’t cause me that much trouble.

    As to collection sidequests, I suppose that it’s as it says on the poll- I try my best until I’m stuck, and then I have to look the locations up. Sometimes, I manage to get quite far (perhaps because I tend to wander around an awful lot for no reason other than to do so), but I usually end up stuck one way or another… and, as I like to fully complete games when I can for the sense of completion, I usually end up using a strategy guide.

    (Admittedly, I don’t feel too bad about doing this, as I get the feeling I would get horrifically frustrated searching for them myself- I have a considerable amount of admiration for those who find all of these things without using a strategy guide, and I tend to lack the ability to see the simplest things…).

    Other sidequests (which don’t involve simply scouring every inch of Hyrule for bugs, seashells, and goodness knows what else), I’m perfectly happy to do… and admittedly, I’m probably more likely to fare better in them than a collection sidequest (I suppose that they can also be more interesting…? I enjoy sidequests which have some sort of storyline) due to the aforementioned lack of observation I seem to possess… unless the collection sidequest is quite ’simple’ (the recipe collection in Tales of Symphonia as opposed to the Poe Souls in TP, for example), of course.

    … Ah, I apologise for the rather long post. In conclusion, I suppose that my take on the matter is pretty much the second option on the poll… only perhaps presented in a slightly more long-winded manner. Heh…

    You caught me red handed! I use strategy guides and I don’t always complete all the sidequests. Lol, the only reason I even go back to Fanadi is to take another look at her weird house and questionable heritage… (I don’t want to mention it because it might be considered spoilerish - but, she is, isn’t she?) But those poes, gosh darnit! I’ll get ‘em. If only because I hate them grrrr….

    :D

    • 10. EA says:

    A friend and I did a 100% completion of OoT, only using the guide for the last few Skulltulas. But that was a collaborative effort tht will, most likely, never repeat itself!

    Anyway, aren’t Zelda games supposed to foster communication and outside help? It may be “cheating” in a hard gamer’s pov when you use a guide book, but really, you’re creating a tiny sense of community when you BUY that guidebook…SEARCH for that walkthrough. We are not island gamers, and the simple fact that we’re online discussing these things proves it.

    So you use an outside source to get 100% completion of a game — GOOD. It may be small, but you’re preparing yourself to deal with problems that may come your way in real life. No one can solve every problem on their own - find every possible solution (life’s own collection side-quests!) - on their own. You have to find outside resources and outside help.

    But this is just me rambling. I voted “okay, 192½ is a little crazy” by the way :D

    I usually try to find most things, but I find it hard to motivate myself to do it when the end item sucks. If I end up with an awesome reward for completing the quest, I’m all for it. Otherwise, I’ll just collect anything I happen to run across.

    I, too, selected that 192 1/2 is a little crazy; I find as many of an object as I can without going insane. I find it’s really not worth it, considering as how the only reward is generally a boost for your ego.

    My idea of improved Zelda side-quests has already been realized, but in the wrong way. Wind Waker’s Triforce shard hunt! Yes, I know, as an integral part of the game, and in place of a real dungeon, it was awful…but as an optional side-quest, searching for the charts, paying extravagant fees to have them interpreted (money you’d choose to work for), and, finally, hauling up some buried treasure would be a blast! Essentially, it is a collection quest, yes, but it’s really more along the lines of a bunch of Biggoron Sword quests rolled up into one. I’m all for seeing something in-depth like this in future Zelda games, just so long as they don’t replace the mainstays of dungeons and the like.

    P.S. My favorite collection quest ever was the figurine gallery in tWW. >__>

    I want a good Optional Dungeon sidequest. One like the hrmm of hrmblrhrms in TP. Only more dungeon-ish. Not a big dungeon, but it should be a cool little cranny to explore. Say about fifteen rooms, one floor, a key or two and a monster or monsters of mini-boss difficulty. For me, trading quests get boring, collection-quests feel more dragged-out than One Piece (ten years man, and they’re still no closer to finding One Piece than in the beginning). I just want a real quest to be given. That’s one thing that they could do with the Wii-connect 24 on future Zelda titles, have sidequests for downloading. The makers of Orb are planning to do that with their game. BTW if you want to look into Orb more head over to http://www.crossbeamstudios.com/ It looks promising. But all in all, TP had some fu stuff with the poe quest, what with some of those secret caves. They just were’nt dungeony enough for me.

    Jumanji Shishioh said:

    Well, it wasn’t one of the options in the poll, but I would first find things on my own (in TP) and then when I ran out of places to hunt, I need a guide to help.

    That would be the second option. ;)

    EA said:

    Anyway, aren’t Zelda games supposed to foster communication and outside help? It may be “cheating” in a hard gamer’s pov when you use a guide book, but really, you’re creating a tiny sense of community when you BUY that guidebook…SEARCH for that walkthrough. We are not island gamers, and the simple fact that we’re online discussing these things proves it.

    Well, now you’ve got all the online guides at GameFAQs which compete with the traditional pay-for strategy guides. I think a lot less people will buy the official books these days. (Personally, I buy Zelda guides primarily for the official art.) To some degree you’re right, but that argument is slowly shrinking away.

    im grog on this one….for almost every game i have ever played

    Grog need psychiatric help. He has issues. ^_*

    Which version of OoT we talking? I used a guide the first time I played it (still didn’t collect all the skulutas though). When I received Master Quest however, I decided to look through Hyrule on my own and collect every last thing without help. (Sense I hadn’t played the original in quite some time, I had forgotten most of the locations of heart pieces, and other things, so it still counts.)
    However, I don’t do the collecting nearly as much as I used to. I still try for all the hearts, and maybe the weapon upgrades if I know where to get them, but the big collection quest in TP still sits only half done on my copy.

    Sesshorochikuramaru said:

    im grog on this one….for almost every game i have ever played

    I feel the same way for alot of the time. But then there are other times when I want to see what I can get at the end so I use an online GameFaqs guide.

    The only games I have ever topped to 100% (wholly on my own) are still ALttP and MM But that was when I was 14 and on vacation respectively; I took the coward’s way with OoT and ran for cover beneath the strategy guide. But I agree with you. It’s simply tedious. Explore the whole known world? Nope, I wouldn’t plan to do so by looking out for eight-legged gold freaks.

    I was almost going to declare sympathy for Grog, but then I remembered the reward some of the item collecting quests yield (that is, to my mind came the first, and only necessary, time Squall unleashed the Lion Heart upon Ultima Weapon), so I had to click on the option above.

    Why can’t there be more collecting quests with rewards such as the Ultimate Renzokuken or the Biggoron Sword?

    Very very good article TML! I like this one alot.

    I don’t know if anyone has mentioned this already (I just woke up and I don’t have the brainpower to read everyone’s magnificent quotes, im sure ;) ), but this is the main reason I LOVE the Xbox 360. With every single game you buy (as in the $60 ones from the store), you can earn 1000 Gamerscore points for completeing the game and doing an assortment of other tasks. Of course this doesn’t include every single little thing you can get (and TES:4 shows this a great deal, I can tell you that; it took me around four straight months to do every single thing in that game), but it’s a wide majority. The Xbox Live Arcade Games that you can buy host 250 Gamerscore points to gain, and the same goes for any expansion pack for a game (even though TES:4 Shivering Isles is the only expansion for the 360 right now). It is, truly, the sole reason I like my Xbox better than my Wii. I used to be a 100% Nintendo fanboy for oh so many years. I would only play a Nintendo game on a Nintendo system, sayin’ screw you to Microsoft and Sony straight outta the box. But this whole Gamerscore thing, even though it really doesn’t do anything for you in the fullest sense of the word, makes me want to play my games over and over and over again until I get every single Gamerscore point for that game. It almost becomes an addiction to strive for every single one and almost have a seizure when you see that Achievement Unlocked symbol at the top of your screen and then watching your Gamerscore increase. This, along with Xbox Live, is the reason why I think that Microsoft will win the console war this generation, and why they already may have. Your Gamerscore shows to the entire world how good of a gamer you are, and it becomes more of a competition, but an extremely fun and envigorating one at that. Trust me, for those of you who don’t have a 360 (and even those of you that do for the most part, I believe), you would play your 360 more often for that reason. It’s kinda hard to explain if you haven’t experienced it yourself. But yeah, if the Wii had Gamerscore points, I would play it more than I do my 360 right now.

    Shinigami Ninja said:

    Sesshorochikuramaru said:

    im grog on this one….for almost every game i have ever played

    I feel the same way for alot of the time. But then there are other times when I want to see what I can get at the end so I use an online GameFaqs guide.

    if i spend to much time away from the plot in any game i start to get bored with it… thats why i hate sidequests :P

    Sesshorochikuramaru said:

    Shinigami Ninja said:

    Sesshorochikuramaru said:

    im grog on this one….for almost every game i have ever played

    I feel the same way for alot of the time. But then there are other times when I want to see what I can get at the end so I use an online GameFaqs guide.

    if i spend to much time away from the plot in any game i start to get bored with it… thats why i hate sidequests :P

    Yep, same here. Or if I get stuck and the plot starts to lose its motivational effect or I haven’t had any plot exposure for a long time then I get bored and set it aside. But then there are other times too when I just get annoyed by a turned-based RPG system and never finish the game(FFI, FFII, FFIV(gba versions), Skies of Arcadia, LoTR: The Third Age.) The only trun based RPGs I’ve ever finished are pokemon games and the Golden Sun series.

    On Mario 64, i used a game guide online for ONE star i couldnt find, and as it turns out… *sigh* it was a star in the cavern with Bowser’s submarine it, and it was the star you have to colloect coins for (in evry level you can collect 100 coins for an extra star, right?)!!!!! the triple jump and free 100 lives were nice though ;) i also found this weird glitch where if you run up a certain side of the castle on the upper part, you would fall through into the castle! the weird thing is, when you walk through the door to get back outside of the castle, you ended up outside of the castle, just with the old fashioned inside of he castle room and music! has anyone found this :? ?

    Always cheat to get the last few trinkets and am not afraid to out myself publicly. I don’t have the proper mentality that’s rife for spending hours flushing over the game world, encovering every last secret. I’ll give the world a couple of sweeps, but when I’m five poes short and have exhausted every possible means, I throw in the towel. It’s just not worth spending so much time on the random chance that I might happen to stumble upon what I’m looking for. At that point it no longer becomes about skill. It almost becomes unquantifiable luck.

    my little brother(not kakashi)had me look up were to find almost all the skulitas and heart pieces in OoT -_- .. i won OoT with only the easy heart pieces,i was to lazy too walk out of the castle to get the extra DEF from the fairy,i only killed the skulitas that were right in front of me but i did get the goron sword and the spells, that was fun :)

    Shinigami Ninja said:But then there are other times too when I just get annoyed by a turned-based RPG system and never finish the game(FFI, FFII, FFIV(gba versions

    FF1 is really kinda borring…what part did you get to in FF II and IV? because there is a part in both were they get pretty interesting..

    Well, I have to say TML, I feel the same way. I used to love collecting everything, I even remember that sweet feeling when I beat DKC and DKC2 102%. Those were the days… Now I’m all busy and such as I get older. But TP was actually a lot better for me, I enjoyed travelling a lot more, and I actually had all heart pieces before beating the game.

    For me, the most important facets of a game are characters and story. If I’m bored, I may end up collecting all 192-and-a-half doohickeys — but the only thing that will really motivate me to do so is if it unlocks an alternate ending to the game. Even then, I’ll only start collecting if it looks either a) fun, b) not much harder than the main game, or c) exponentially harder than the whole rest of the game combined (I love insanely challenging quests). HOWEVER: I have no compunction about using strategy guides. I usually try to limit how much I use them if the quest is fun or I’m doing it for the challenge, but annoying or boring quests standing between me and a cool game ending … die. Quickly. Zelda collection quests, which rarely have much in the way of storyline significance, character exposition, or inherent enjoyability generally fall to GameFAQs.

    I take this “characters are number one” philosophy pretty far — I don’t really feel a need to buy most video games. There are dozens of games where the story interested me, but I didn’t want to spend my sparse funds. Usually in scenarios like that I’ll go read through a game script and be satisfied. The few games I do buy are either sequels of games I’ve already gotten, or games with stories so precious I come back to them again and again. (With the exception of FF8, which I love tremendously but haven’t been able to get for various reasons).

    A great example is Path of Radiance. To me, the fact that your characters stay dead when they die is a good thing. It makes me treat the game more seriously than I might have otherwise, and victory is more enjoyable. It helps me remember that the people I’m fighting are just as real as the good guys, just as filled with hopes and fears and potential. If you were fighting an actual war, where every mistake meant the death of someone relying on you, you probably wouldn’t hesitate to pull out “The Art of War” by Sun Tzu or “On Guerilla Warfare” by Mao tse-Tung. I’m not one of those who feels that “all is fair in love and war,” but I’d be willing to go fairly far to win a genuine battle. And to me, a game developer who tries to separate me from the characters I love is as much enemy as friend. It’s a love-hate relationship.

    Im grog number seven :? .everytime I see a “collect (insert large number here) items” type thing,I instantly get to thinking that i’ll only get about half (or less) of them :P .I actually did win LOZ with everything……about seven times in a row when I was five or six,and the only help I had was watching my dad play it (though I can asure you I didnt watch-let alone remember ;) -everything,if I recall corectly some of the monsters scared me out of the room :) ) .how I had the pateince to actually leave death mountain to fill up my wallet i’ll never know :| .but anyways,maybe if the games were harder I would put a little more effort into finding heart pieces but as it stands you could probably win most of the games with the hearts you get from the dungeon bosses.see,in LOZ you kind of need all the hearts you can get because the amazing,magical pig ganon is so hard that 20 hearts arn’t really enough :? .but in the newer games none of the enemies (let alone bosses,save a few) damage you enough to the point that you need more life (not that I expect an enemy to take out all your hearts in one hit,you know what im saying :) ).also if the items they gave away for completing the side quests were a little more useful I would probably be a little more motivated to get them (a magic rod in particular would be nice :( ) but they all just seem useless (and boring since they are usually just rupees or heart containers).

    btw,I generally try not to cheat……but some how I always end up doing so 0_o .

    Sesshorochikuramaru said:
    if i spend to much time away from the plot in any game i start to get bored with it… thats why i hate sidequests :P

    such as the map battles in FE:8 :P ? I decided to challenge myself to never use those :) (though I supose I should have seen if that were possible on any mode besides hard mode :( ).

    uberzeldamaster said:the weird thing is, when you walk through the door to get back outside of the castle, you ended up outside of the castle, just with the old fashioned inside of he castle room and music! has anyone found this :? ?

    the last time I played mario 64 it was on the DS,so I would imagine that I never had a chance of finding it .

    speaking of,what was it in super mario sunshine that you were talking about TML :P ? I know I have a few stars that I dread having to get :? .my brother has some 97 shine sprites,I have to wonder just how much patience he has :P .

    Only a few games have I actually completed 100%, one of them being Twilight Princess. And yes, I must confess, all of these few games but one involved the turning on of my computor to see Gamefaqs. Heck! I’m currently working to get 100% on StarFox 64 and I even used Gamefaqs for that! I even have Gamefaqs on the other browser tab right now so I can make Megaman BN 5 a little easier! ……………………I need some air.

    Light Walker said:

    If I’m bored, I may end up collecting all 192-and-a-half doohickeys — but the only thing that will really motivate me to do so is if it unlocks an alternate ending to the game.

    Oooh, an alternate ending might even be better than an optional dungeon!

    uberzeldamaster said:

    On Mario 64, i used a game guide online for ONE star i couldnt find, and as it turns out… *sigh* it was a star in the cavern with Bowser’s submarine it, and it was the star you have to colloect coins for (in evry level you can collect 100 coins for an extra star, right?)!!!!! the triple jump and free 100 lives were nice though ;) i also found this weird glitch where if you run up a certain side of the castle on the upper part, you would fall through into the castle! the weird thing is, when you walk through the door to get back outside of the castle, you ended up outside of the castle, just with the old fashioned inside of he castle room and music! has anyone found this :? ?

    Actually, that trick was quite well known back in the day…

    If I spy a collection quest I’m interested in, I’ll go for it. There were times in Twilight Princess that I would’ve killed for a couple more hearts (Haha, killed…Mmmm, Bokoblin sniping…). But, for the most part, I go through the entire game first without a strategy guide (Unless I’m really, really, really stuck. It’s usually something really dumb when I get stuck. I often fail to look up or down…^^’). Once I’ve beaten it the first time, then I’ll qhip out the handy dandy strategy guide and go and collect every single tiny thing I can find.

    Don’t worry, TML, you aren’t the only one who finds F Zero GX maddingly hard.

    I can’t even unlock Master difficulty And all I have to do is beat Emerald Cup on Expert (Yeah, I beat the other two on expert, except for Diamond…)

    INSANELY HARD!

    But also insanely fun at times…

    Sesshorochikuramaru said:

    my little brother(not kakashi)had me look up were to find almost all the skulitas and heart pieces in OoT -_- .. i won OoT with only the easy heart pieces,i was to lazy too walk out of the castle to get the extra DEF from the fairy,i only killed the skulitas that were right in front of me but i did get the goron sword and the spells, that was fun :)

    Shinigami Ninja said:But then there are other times too when I just get annoyed by a turned-based RPG system and never finish the game(FFI, FFII, FFIV(gba versions

    FF1 is really kinda borring…what part did you get to in FF II and IV? because there is a part in both were they get pretty interesting..

    In II I don’t remember. In IV I got to the underword.I think. I haven’t played either for a while and I don’t plan to play them anytime soon. But anyway, back to topic. Now that we’ve established that just about everyone hates collection quests, what kind of quests do you think are the best and which was your favorite? Mine was the Cave of hrmblehrum on TP. The one in WW was good to but I like TP better, Darknuts are fun, so are the rooms with a thousand little skeleton people. BOMBS FTW!

    I have to admit, I’m one of those obsessive compulsive people that completes absolutely EVERYTHING in a video game. Yes, i did vote for ‘King of Zelda’, because that is SO me. The only thing I do on cheat sites is look at glitches, such as that Super Mario 64 one. There’s something about the challenge that makes me want to find all 192 1/2 magical dohickeys. TML, when you said you made a chart for the figurines in Minish Cap, I was amazed. I did the same thing, but by hand. I charted out how many kinstones I cuold still fuse (in hopes of finding chests with shells in them), and I charted how many rupees i needed to get to buy shells from the dude in the town shop(the place was a rip-off, and YES, i spent hours cutting grass to collect rupees!). So, I guess you could say I’m geek too. I’ve mastered many games without cheats, and I am PROUD OF IT! Such awesome games include Super Mario 64, Super Mario 64 DS, Minish Cap, Twilight Princess, Majora’s Mask, Ocarina of Time, A Link to the Past, and a bunch of DK games I won’t write out, so I will stop typing and wasting time.

    The Emerald Wind said:

    Actually, that trick was quite well known back in the day…

    Back in the day?! I still have my N64, and I play it everyday. Also, I still have Super Mario 64.

    Never really FINISHED it, never really will. :P

    Oh, I feel so hated right now…

    The Master Swordsman said:

    Never really FINISHED it, never really will. :P

    Oh, I feel so hated right now…

    What? OoT? You have got to at least get to the end.

    Of the Zelda games, I’ve 100%-ed LttP, OoT, OoA, TP, and, I think, OoS. My vote went to the second option. I’ve been able to find most of so-and-so items and clear some temples by myself, but there are times where I give in, and go to a strategy guide; book or Internet.

    There are games that I don’t bother 100%-ing, like Paper Mario: The Thousand Year Door, (I don’t have the time or patience to go through that pit of 100 trials) Nintendogs, (I got most, if not all, of the Mario items available to that version. After getting the same things over and over again from those walks, I lose the patience) and Animal Crossing. (100%-ing that is nearly impossible!)

    Kojinka said:

    Of the Zelda games, I’ve 100%-ed LttP, OoT, OoA, TP, and, I think, OoS. My vote went to the second option. I’ve been able to find most of so-and-so items and clear some temples by myself, but there are times where I give in, and go to a strategy guide; book or Internet.

    There are games that I don’t bother 100%-ing, like Paper Mario: The Thousand Year Door, (I don’t have the time or patience to go through that pit of 100 trials) Nintendogs, (I got most, if not all, of the Mario items available to that version. After getting the same things over and over again from those walks, I lose the patience) and Animal Crossing. (100%-ing that is nearly impossible!)

    I’ve never understood nintendogs. What’s the fun?

    sniper said:
    (the place was a rip-off, and YES, i spent hours cutting grass to collect rupees!).

    I got all the figurines……but I have….hmmm…quicker methods of finding the rupees to do so.for example,once you get the claws go to links house,when you get there stand right by the door and dig to your left,you should get a red rupee.all you have to do then is go in the house,come back out,and repeat the process for an unlimited amount of money.alternatively there is a pot on mount…uh…well the mountain where you find your second dungeon (I think its car-something :? ) that always has a red rupee in it (the same rules apply as with the dig spot).

    Shinigami Ninja said:

    Now that we’ve established that just about everyone hates collection quests, what kind of quests do you think are the best and which was your favorite?

    grog like simple things :P (easy is nice too though).I would like there to be dungeons hidden across hyrule that arn’t plot related but still have a rod treasure in it other than heart pieces or a large rupee.I dont mind the trading games since they are usually pretty simple and can be fun (excluding the one in TWW….no fun in that one).as for my favorite one…that would probably be the on in TP (you know which one ;) ).

    My favourite plot quests have been:

    • The random bonus items in LttP. (I actually still have an article about this from last year that I never finished writing!)
    • The Biggoron Sword quest (because you get the best item in the game for doing some light puzzle work)
    • The Masks (they actually DO something)
    • The Minish Cap Figurines (because you don’t have to hunt them; there’s one way of getting them, and you just have to spend shells wisely)
    • The Wind Waker Triforce Hunt (because there was a puzzle associated with it)
    • Linking the two Oracle games (because it’s really cool to pull upgraded versions of items from one game into the other)

    Shinigami Ninja said:

    I’ve never understood nintendogs. What’s the fun?

    My friend got me Nintendogs for Christmas, and I played it for one day while I was on vacation. It was really fun, and I completely intended on continuing. And then I flew back home and had to take care of real pets… and I decided I didn’t need another one, so I never played again.

    Ninja Lord Kakashi said:

    sniper said:
    (the place was a rip-off, and YES, i spent hours cutting grass to collect rupees!).

    I got all the figurines……but I have….hmmm…quicker methods of finding the rupees to do so.for example,once you get the claws go to links house,when you get there stand right by the door and dig to your left,you should get a red rupee.all you have to do then is go in the house,come back out,and repeat the process for an unlimited amount of money.alternatively there is a pot on mount…uh…well the mountain where you find your second dungeon (I think its car-something :? ) that always has a red rupee in it (the same rules apply as with the dig spot).

    I found that after you get the pegasus boots, it’s effective to go into the mayor’s house and knocking down the masks off the wall. It’s something like getting rupees 95% of the time. It ranges from 1 rupee to 60 rupees every time. This also works in the library.

    what kinda game is Nintendogs anyways…? it always sounded kinda fun to me, but do you keep your pets or do you have to let other people adopt them? and also do they have a Nintencats game too? ;)

    Nintendogs is fun for a few days then you get REALLY bored.

    Ninja Lord Kakashi said:

    sniper said:
    (the place was a rip-off, and YES, i spent hours cutting grass to collect rupees!).

    I got all the figurines……but I have….hmmm…quicker methods of finding the rupees to do so.for example,once you get the claws go to links house,when you get there stand right by the door and dig to your left,you should get a red rupee.all you have to do then is go in the house,come back out,and repeat the process for an unlimited amount of money.alternatively there is a pot on mount…uh…well the mountain where you find your second dungeon (I think its car-something :? ) that always has a red rupee in it (the same rules apply as with the dig spot).

    I used that spot for so long… I still don’t have ‘em all. TML, what is the perfect number of rupees to use?

    Sesshorochikuramaru said:

    what kinda game is Nintendogs anyways…? it always sounded kinda fun to me, but do you keep your pets or do you have to let other people adopt them? and also do they have a Nintencats game too? ;)

    Your a cat person aren’t you? The only reason I could see to buy Nintendogs is if you want a dog but your parents won’t let you get one.

    Shinigami Ninja said:Your a cat person aren’t you? The only reason I could see to buy Nintendogs is if you want a dog but your parents won’t let you get one.

    yeah i am :) i have this computer game called Dogz and Catz…that held my attention for about a year but the sound stopped working on it, and the meowing and barking was half of the fun of it :( …anyways you could also collect toys and stuff for them and i got all of those things so i guess i did get 100% on a game ;) too bad it all my stuff got erased in it ;_;

    I’ve gotten all of the masks in MM, just to get the FD mask. ahh… memories.
    hmm..I won’t get EVERYTHING, but I will get a good chunk of stuff, ESPECIALLY if it deals with fighting. I love those caverns…. *drool*
    I guess I’m a bit like grog, except a bit more streamlined.

    I don’t want to sound like a *rear end* here, but no one has any feedback on my post?

    Josephina said:

    I don’t want to sound like a *rear end* here, but no one has any feedback on my post?

    sorry, but i dont really understand it, because i dont have a xbox

    Heh. I DID finish the game, I just never really got everything in the game.

    The Master Swordsman said:

    Heh. I DID finish the game, I just never really got everything in the game.

    haha did you use this??

    https://zeldablog.com/2006/08/31/ocarina-of-time-quick-and-dirty/

    Josephina said:

    I don’t want to sound like a *rear end* here, but no one has any feedback on my post?

    So the Live Arcade games and add-on stuff are the only things you can get with Gamerpoints? Forgive me, but isn’t that like a collection quest in and of itself? o_o;

    Sesshorochikuramaru said:

    Josephina said:

    I don’t want to sound like a *rear end* here, but no one has any feedback on my post?

    sorry, but i dont really understand it, because i dont have a xbox

    Yeah, I totally understand what you mean. You don’t really know unless you have one. I believe TML has a 360 (yes?) so I’m sure he knows what I’m talking about.

    VenusQueenOfFaeries said:

    Josephina said:

    I don’t want to sound like a *rear end* here, but no one has any feedback on my post?

    So the Live Arcade games and add-on stuff are the only things you can get with Gamerpoints? Forgive me, but isn’t that like a collection quest in and of itself? o_o;

    No, no, no. I’m not trying to be mean here, but how did you get that outta my post? OH! Are you thinking you can redeem things with Gamerscore points? Nope. Gamerscore, in essence, is totally worthless. All it is is a number that is like your reputation on Xbox Live (even though there is a whole different section for that). Like if you see someone with, oh, 250 or 300 Gamerscore, you can tell either:

    1. They just bought a 360.

    2. They are a casual gamer.

    3. They suck ;) .

    So yeah. It’s your social status score for Xbox Live. You can earn up to 1000 points for a $60 game, and 250 for XBL Arcade Games and expansions. I think you may be confused with Microsoft Points, which you have to pay for with a credit card to use towards XBL Marketplace purchases. Does that answer your question? I’m not too sure it did :? .

    I forget how much I collected on my own or with a guide so I just chose a random answer.

    Josephina said:

    I don’t want to sound like a *rear end* here, but no one has any feedback on my post?

    I do have a 360; it was actually my most recent purchase now that a few decent games are out for it and that I got a good deal on one. (I literally got it after the Wii.)

    GamerPoints is a really powerful idea among the 360 vets, and I can certainly see why. The only reward we’ve ever had for going off and doing something is bragging rights, and unless someone is there watching you do it, your word is never quite good enough to validate the boast. Things haven’t changed much; we still only get bragging rights… but now there’s a database that shows precisely what you’ve done and when. Instant validation. In addition, every reward has some points value which adds to your score. It’s basically an RPG meta-game where you’re trying to level up your score so that you can boast to your friends. Fairly simple concept.

    For many people, it’s a cool concept, and it leads people to do things they ordinarily wouldn’t do. (My fellow 360 friends have oft mention that they start following “nonstandard” strategies when playing games—especially multiplayer—because they want to get a certain achievement to boost their score.

    However, personally, I don’t get a kick out of it as much. My GamerScore is a paltry 850 points. A lot of it boils down to effort/point ratios. If something would take more effort than the points it’s worth, I don’t go do it. If something is relatively easy to do and it’s fun, I shoot for it. But I don’t alter my basic game strategy for points typically. But that’s me.

    Josephina said:

    OH! Are you thinking you can redeem things with Gamerscore points? Nope. Gamerscore, in essence, is totally worthless. All it is is a number that is like your reputation on Xbox Live.

    I see. And this number varies for each game? Like, if you’re playing one game that you’ve completed, it’s 1000, but if you’re playing a game you just started, it’s 100 or something? That’s cool; it’d let those “I MUST 100% THIS GAME!” people know how close they are, and bragging rights are always rewarding. That’s not a bad setup, actually.

    And yes, I was thinking of something very similar to Microsoft Points. ^_^;;

    VenusQueenOfFaeries said:

    I see. And this number varies for each game? Like, if you’re playing one game that you’ve completed, it’s 1000, but if you’re playing a game you just started, it’s 100 or something? That’s cool; it’d let those “I MUST 100% THIS GAME!” people know how close they are, and bragging rights are always rewarding. That’s not a bad setup, actually.

    And yes, I was thinking of something very similar to Microsoft Points. ^_^;;

    Nope. Each disc-based game comes with 1,000 GamerPoints and each XBLA game comes with 250. And they’re completely and solely for bragging rights.

    Sesshorochikuramaru said:

    The Master Swordsman said:

    Heh. I DID finish the game, I just never really got everything in the game.

    haha did you use this??

    https://zeldablog.com/2006/08/31/ocarina-of-time-quick-and-dirty/

    No. I did not. :P

    The Master Swordsman said:

    Heh. I DID finish the game, I just never really got everything in the game.

    lol,me too. i just used the nice and generous GameFAQs for the last dreaded,evil,stuck-in-the-toilet gold skullwalltas.It was only 2!!!everything else i did and beat and all that fun stuff :P

    They should make a side-quest where you have to beat every boss in the game one after the other, In a optional dungeon of course.

    The Master Swordsman said:No. I did not. :P

    aww i thought for sure that you made a riddle about that glitch ^_^’ BTW i always wanted to try the quick and dirty glitch ;)

    Josephina said:

    I don’t want to sound like a *rear end* here, but no one has any feedback on my post?

    I dont have an Xbox,last I checked the games on it didnt particularly interest me.naturally I really dont understand what you (or several others) are talking about and as a result my opinion on the matter is pretty much meaningless.what games are all on the Xbox anyways? i’ll admit that the last time I checked was a very long time ago.in any case,the points system sounds like an interesting idea,though not the kind of thing that would motivate me into doing mindless sidequests….mainly because…

    Josephina said:
    Like if you see someone with, oh, 250 or 300 Gamerscore, you can tell either:

    1. They just bought a 360.

    2. They are a casual gamer.

    3. They suck ;) .

    …I sort of qualify for all three of those :P (asuming ofcoarse I had an Xbox) .as you can imagine,braging rights arn’t something I would 100% a game for….cheap alternative endings are though ( *caugh*FFX-2*caugh* ).

    I would get a 360 if it met the following conditions:

    1. More than 50% of the good games on it weren’t rated ‘M’ (parents have a thing about that)
    2. It was roughly $100-$200 cheaper.

    3.If it had more than two games that interest me.

    But I know none of that will ever happen.

    yeah… xbox looks like most of there games are err… bad or really violent. i only play up to T games…theres only one M game that looks kinda cool..it only looks interesting because one of the charactors is kinda cute because its about samurais and samurais are right up there with ninjas ;)

    I’m a devoted nintendo fan, so the only thing I want to do with X-box 360 is Banjo-Kazooie 3.

    AH! I’m drowing in feedback! LOL. ;)

    VenusQueenOfFaeries said:

    Josephina said:

    OH! Are you thinking you can redeem things with Gamerscore points? Nope. Gamerscore, in essence, is totally worthless. All it is is a number that is like your reputation on Xbox Live.

    I see. And this number varies for each game? Like, if you’re playing one game that you’ve completed, it’s 1000, but if you’re playing a game you just started, it’s 100 or something? That’s cool; it’d let those “I MUST 100% THIS GAME!” people know how close they are, and bragging rights are always rewarding. That’s not a bad setup, actually.

    And yes, I was thinking of something very similar to Microsoft Points. ^_^;;

    Um, OK. As TML said on his comment on your post Venus, each game comes with 1000 Gamerpoints to earn and each XBL comes with 200 or 250 to earn (this is for the most part, for instance games like Crackdown only has 900 Gamerscore and I have no idea why). I kinda forgot to explain Achievements, too, didn’t I? Usually for a game, there’s between 20 and 50 Achievements to earn, and around 10 to 15 for a XBL Arcade game or whatever. For each Achievement you have to, well, achieve what that specific Achievement wants you to do in the game (pun is intended by the way), and for each Achievement you unlock, you get the number of Gamerscore that is intended for that Achievement. And yes, after your finished with the game (generally) you have either 1000 or 250 or whatever Gamerscore for that game. So yeah, I think you understand the concept, but I thought I would clarify. Whew.

    The Missing Link said:

    However, personally, I don’t get a kick out of it as much. My GamerScore is a paltry 850 points. A lot of it boils down to effort/point ratios. If something would take more effort than the points it’s worth, I don’t go do it. If something is relatively easy to do and it’s fun, I shoot for it. But I don’t alter my basic game strategy for points typically. But that’s me.

    And that is also the truth. A lot of people I play with on XBL don’t gave a *fairy’s butt* about Gamerscore. I know a lot of nice people who have even such a small number as 250. Also, I play Gears of War a ton. A lot of the Achievements you can earn for that game involve killing one hundred people over XBL with almost every weapon in the game (I believe that there are six or eight of them available for like a total of 300 Gamerscore or something), so people are always like, “I NEEZ TEH TORK BO RITE NOW SO I CAN GET TEH ACHEEVEMNT CUZ IM AN ACHEEVMNT HOR [email protected]!!!!!!q1″. I don’t mean to use the profane language there, but you get my point. A lot of people tend to focus too much on the Achievement system (as I do sometimes), so it can take the fun out for some people. It all depends on your personality and how much time you devote into gaming.

    Sesshorochikuramaru said:

    yeah… xbox looks like most of there games are err… bad or really violent. i only play up to T games…theres only one M game that looks kinda cool..it only looks interesting because one of the charactors is kinda cute because its about samurais and samurais are right up there with ninjas ;)

    Dead Or Alive 4? That game rules.

    Ninja Lord Kakashi said:

    I dont have an Xbox,last I checked the games on it didnt particularly interest me.naturally I really dont understand what you (or several others) are talking about and as a result my opinion on the matter is pretty much meaningless.what games are all on the Xbox anyways? i’ll admit that the last time I checked was a very long time ago.in any case,the points system sounds like an interesting idea,though not the kind of thing that would motivate me into doing mindless sidequests….mainly because…

    Josephina said:
    Like if you see someone with, oh, 250 or 300 Gamerscore, you can tell either:

    1. They just bought a 360.

    2. They are a casual gamer.

    3. They suck ;) .

    …I sort of qualify for all three of those :P

    I actually am a big fan of shooters, and that’s the majority of the games for the 360, but there’s a bunch of games for different tastes out there. If you give me a favorite genre, I’ll give you a great game. Simple as that. And I love your honesty ;) .

    Josephina said:

    Dead Or Alive 4? That game rules.

    Genji… i think.. does anyone know genji means :? & what unit is “dead or alive 4″ for anyways PS2/3 or 360?

    Genji is the name of an era in feudal Japan and is also the name of a Japanese Clan. Also due to the beginning of a new 60-year cycle of the Chinese zodiac, on March 27, Bunkyū 4 (1864), the era became Genji (”Original Rule”). September 5, Genji Gannen(Fifth day of ninth month, old calendar) is the anniversary of the Bombardment of Shimonoseki which was a series of little-known engagements fought from 1863-64 by naval forces of Great Britain, the Netherlands, France and the United States, against the powerful feudal Japanese warlord or daimyo Lord Mori Takachika of the Chōshū clan based in Shimonoseki, Japan. This conflict threatened to involve America, which in 1863 was already torn by civil strife, in a foreign war.

    Robert-UK said:

    Genji is the name of an era in feudal Japan and is also the name of a Japanese Clan.

    ohh…that makes sence :)

    Josephina said:
    If you give me a favorite genre, I’ll give you a great game. Simple as that. And I love your honesty ;) .

    favorite genre? how about….RPG? or failing that,adventure.also yes,im very honest :D .

    Robert-UK said:

    Genji is the name of an era in feudal Japan and is also the name of a Japanese Clan. Also due to the beginning of a new 60-year cycle of the Chinese zodiac, on March 27, Bunkyū 4 (1864), the era became Genji (”Original Rule”). September 5, Genji Gannen(Fifth day of ninth month, old calendar) is the anniversary of the Bombardment of Shimonoseki which was a series of little-known engagements fought from 1863-64 by naval forces of Great Britain, the Netherlands, France and the United States, against the powerful feudal Japanese warlord or daimyo Lord Mori Takachika of the Chōshū clan based in Shimonoseki, Japan. This conflict threatened to involve America, which in 1863 was already torn by civil strife, in a foreign war.

    *grabs head* ahhhh,too much! lets see then,”genji” is a japanese era,clan,and…an anniversary of a war :? ?

    Robert-UK said:

    Genji is the name of an era in feudal Japan and is also the name of a Japanese Clan. Also due to the beginning of a new 60-year cycle of the Chinese zodiac, on March 27, Bunkyū 4 (1864), the era became Genji (”Original Rule”). September 5, Genji Gannen(Fifth day of ninth month, old calendar) is the anniversary of the Bombardment of Shimonoseki which was a series of little-known engagements fought from 1863-64 by naval forces of Great Britain, the Netherlands, France and the United States, against the powerful feudal Japanese warlord or daimyo Lord Mori Takachika of the Chōshū clan based in Shimonoseki, Japan. This conflict threatened to involve America, which in 1863 was already torn by civil strife, in a foreign war.

    Well, Sessh, you asked for it. How the heck do you know so much about this stuff?

    The only 360 game I want is Oblivion, but it’d be cheaper to upgrade my computer than get a 360.

    Robert-UK said:

    Genji is the name of an era in feudal Japan and is also the name of a Japanese Clan.

    Genji also has giant enemy crabs.

    The Missing Link said:Genji also has giant enemy crabs.

    wha..giant..enemy..crabs…? lol

    The Missing Link said:

    Robert-UK said:

    Genji is the name of an era in feudal Japan and is also the name of a Japanese Clan.

    Genji also has giant enemy crabs.

    the game im asuming,right :P ?

    Enemy crabs…? isn’t that like the game where they’re like mutated or something :/

    I go everything except the Ice Arrows.

    Then I looked up on Gamefaqs how to get the Ice arrows.

    I still can’t figure it out.

    extremejon said:

    I go everything except the Ice Arrows.

    Then I looked up on Gamefaqs how to get the Ice arrows.

    I still can’t figure it out.

    whats kind of funny is that thats about the only thing I got in OOT without a guidebook/gamefaqs :P .I believe thats what one would call “dumb luck” :D .

    Shinigami Ninja said:

    Robert-UK said:

    Genji is the name of an era in feudal Japan and is also the name of a Japanese Clan. Also due to the beginning of a new 60-year cycle of the Chinese zodiac, on March 27, Bunkyū 4 (1864), the era became Genji (”Original Rule”). September 5, Genji Gannen(Fifth day of ninth month, old calendar) is the anniversary of the Bombardment of Shimonoseki which was a series of little-known engagements fought from 1863-64 by naval forces of Great Britain, the Netherlands, France and the United States, against the powerful feudal Japanese warlord or daimyo Lord Mori Takachika of the Chōshū clan based in Shimonoseki, Japan. This conflict threatened to involve America, which in 1863 was already torn by civil strife, in a foreign war.

    Well, Sessh, you asked for it. How the heck do you know so much about this stuff?

    The only 360 game I want is Oblivion, but it’d be cheaper to upgrade my computer than get a 360.

    Im a bit of a Japan nut, you should see my stockpile of Sake and Pocky, lol.

    I do more the “Memorize the Game” deal than collection. I usually beat Oot with a guide, and that’s a lot (issues with the Water Temple), but out of the 79 and a half times I’ve beaten it, only around sixteen have been without a guide, and only about four with everything collected. But I beat TP first time, no cheats, and absolutely everything (the guide wasn’t out yet - dang), so give kudos for that. So, yeah, TML, you have the right idea. Theory proved.

    OoT was the only game I’ve ever done without a guide. Unfortunately, there was one heart piece I never found…So with 19 and 3/4 of a heart, I gave up and worked on speed.
    To be noted: speed and I do not mix.
    ^_^